My Take –
Debt T’s analysis of the Dem debates yesterday was right down the middle and I generally agree. Let me qualify, though, with a few points: Debates a year and a half before the actual election are STUPID. The DNC setting the bar so low that TWENTY candidates qualify for said debates is also STUPID; also, we put way too much emphasis on debate performance and score keeping of gotchas. Finally, of the list of people running for president, the vast majority are not really running for president, are wasting our time for their own political purposes, and the party leaders should be ashamed of themselves for enabling it. With my qualifications out of the way, here’s my take:
- Biden – hands down the best bet to beat Trump, even after the circular firing squad.
- Harris – serious candidate, badass. Her attack on Biden, though, was too slick and obviously rehearsed for probably months.
- Warren – great candidate to stay in the Senate where she can actually do some good.
- Buttigieg – go home and run for governor. Come back when you’re older than 14.
- Booker – nice try, stay in the Senate.
- Sanders – FFS, go home.
- Beto – You overstepped, bro. Go home, run for governor or against Cornyn. Maybe somebody will call you for the VP slot.
- Klobuchar – not your time. Stay in the Senate.
- Yang – who?
- Inslee – stay in Washington as governor
- Castro – go home. Run for governor.
- Gabbard – nope. Stay in the
SenateHouse. - Gillibrand – are you kidding? Not in a million years. Stay in the Senate until a real Dem knocks you out.
- Williamson – stay in for a while for the entertainment value and keeping the others honest.
- Delaney – who?
- Ryan – go home. Run for Senate.
- Hickenlooper – great governor, but uninspiring. Maybe a VP pick.
- de Blasio – actually running for governor. Go home.
- Bennet – strong. Stay in the Senate.
- Swalwell – really? Go home.
And finally, a little advice from Samantha Bee – run for Senate, goddammit.
And yet, back here in reality, polls show Bernie kicking Trump’s ass. See https://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/2016/president/us/general_election_trump_vs_sanders-5565.html
So FFS yourself.
What’s amazing is that there’s absolutely no acknowledgement that Bernie controlled the *entire* debate. All the talking points were finally off of Clinton-esque “triangulation,” and on to important matters like Medicare for all.
As for whether Biden could win…well, we’ve already had one attempted coronation. How’d that turn out?
1Houston, we have a problem. Maybe. Kinda sort of. El Jefe we agree. Maybe. Kinda sort of. At least we agree with your list from Buttigieg down to Swalwell. Maybe not total agreement on Swalwell. Should Harris win a place on “the” ticket, there might be a Senate seat for Eric. But it would be in a crowded CA field, so he might be better off keeping his House seat. With Sam Bee we totally agree. Anyone not in the top 3, run for Senate, please.
We diverge on the top 3. There’s a poll from before the debates with Biden leading both Harris and Warren among black Democrats. Suspect that’s an Obama bounce for Biden. Once Biden in actually known by black voters, votes he is in position to lose. http://jobsanger.blogspot.com/2019/06/support-for-dems-before-debate-by.html
Harris, “too slick”??! Polished prepared and badass, OK. Too slick? What next, too young or, not black enough? Nah. I’d go with strong. Read up on her mother, El Jefe. Kamala has the DNA for total badass strong woman.
Warren, “stay in the Senate where she can actually do some good.” That hasn’t worked for Bernie and it won’t for Liz, unless Democrats win and maintain 20 seats. Save your powder for when Uncle Joe has to share the stage with Liz. She’ll wipe the dopey look off his face with Joe’s own baggage.
Narrow the field. A debate with Joe, Kamala and Liz. A solid Harris/Warren ticket will emerge. Hedging our bet, Warren/Harris.
2El Jefe –
3One minor correction in you list, Gabbard is in the House not Senate. The only reason I know is she’s my rep and I wish she was working for our district, not running for President. Last year we had a lava flow, flooding from 50 inches of rain in a few days, and were still recovering from all that. Roads are still closed, homes still inaccessible. Of course there’s been federal, state, and county assistance, but c’mon Tulsi, all hands on deck.
Steve Bullock is most likely to deliver the goods. Klobuchar as VP because of her track record in House & Senate. Mayor Pete is charming, accountable, self-effacing, verbally acrobatic, honest, ethical and deeply religious. I believe also that he is trustworthy.
The salient point most loquacious contributors [here] miss is — governance is best when from the middle, or slightly left of center. Democracy is supposed to be slow which is why trumplthinskin is so dangerous. He appeals to losers.
4Rick@3, welcome to Puerto Rico or any blue state with a disaster. Your Senator Mazie Hirono is the best of the best in the Senate. But with Old Scratch McConnell in the majority, we can all line up for our paper towel, rakes, and tools from Orange Foolius.
5Just gotta say I think Buttigieg makes some good points. I hope he stays in. And Williamson…. I totally agree with you.
However she is the ONLY one that pointedly noted that ripping children from their families is kidnapping! Adoptions of these children sounds like human trafficking to me… our (current) government at work, eh?
6“Once Biden in actually known by black voters”. Really? He’s only been in public life for 50 years and ran in a national election TWICE. Don’t mistake Harris and Booker sniping at him as “knowledge”.
7@Adam – Sorry, Sanders’ time is done. He should have stayed kingmaker and policy pusher.
8We have 20 people running. And not one of them has 4 bankrupts, or has banged a porn star, or given Putin a Ri& job.
9How do you expect to win the no school, Dumb low IQ vote.
With Russia’s help Trump in a landslide.
El Jefe@7 traditionally Democrats have done well among black voters, but there is also a growing recognition that a vote for a centrist Democrat maintains the status quo while the Republicons take progress back two or more steps.
However, Hilz didn’t maintain the Obama coalition in 2016. Her own words bit her in the butt. Expect the same from Biden’s 50 years of baggage. There’s a lot there. But two words – Clarence Thomas. Conversely, Anita Hill, which would hurt him with both blacks and women.
Don’t underestimate the millennials; we were not around 50 years ago, but we’re not impressed by the mess. Telling us what you did 10 years ago doesn’t impress. We want solutions like those offered by Bernie, Kamala and Liz.
10Go ahead,support that anachronism named Joe Biden. If the racist,misogynist and general creepy dude is offered as the candidate,embrace four more years of Trump.
The party is so arrogant and filled with hubris by offering such an anachronism as the candidate….This is more proof as to how out of touch the party is with regard to the real world.
11Agree that Sanders’s time is done.
Biden’s time is done too. He’s never really been Presidential timber, and he’d be at best a mediocre candidate and a nullity as President.
Both should have thought better of running.
12Could someone explain to me just how the DNC is supposed to restrict the candidate field when any attempt to do so — no matter how judicially fair — will result in an unending tide of resentful rhetoric about everything being “rigged.”
13I haven’t watched the debates (I had to work and don’t have time to watch the taped versions), but I am still behind Senator Warren. As much as I would like to see her stay in the Senate, I think she is the best choice to beat Trump in 2020.
As for Mayor Pete, as a gay man, I find him intriguing, but a bit too centrist for my tastes. He might make a good Vice Presidential candidate though, but he wouldn’t put Indiana into play. Indiana is just too far right at the moment.
As for Bernie, I voted for him in the 2016 primaries, but I think his time is over. He could have been a king maker, by throwing his support behind one of the other candidates, but I think his ego is getting in the way of that.
Biden’s time was never. He was a good Vice President, but I don’t think he was ever Presidential material. Way too much baggage in his past.
14I totally disagree. I think Biden is looking more vulnerable as time passes. Harris and Warren represent our best hope for a winning ticket with broad appeal. Biden is just another old white guy (Just like me).
15No matter who wins the nomination, there still leaves a mighty fine, educated, and hopefully honest roster of great leader potential for all the cabinet posts.
16Early, early, early, Gaffes and dirty laundry aplenty for everyone!
You do know that Harris did this twice now? Leaving only one person who has not strayed from this position.
You do know that TPTP have sworn a blood oath? Io wit: Anyone but Warren or Sanders.
Here’s a take no one took.
Slogans, in no particular order. Sales pitches seem like the more apt term. Still, always wished some free spirit would use the generic “No Slogan” which is a of course, still a slogan. When they are used, its only in reference to former officeholders or administrations.
“We spared no expense.” Jurassic Park: ( : –{o >
– We Will Rebuild the Middle Class – We Persist
Win With Warren
– Medicare for All Who Want It
– Go Big. Be Bold. Do Good.
– Accountability to America
– Building Opportunity Together
– Our Best Days Still Lie Ahead
– We Rise
– A Fair Shot for Everyone
– Come Together
– A Fresh Start for America
– One Nation. One Destiny
– Focus on the Future
– Lead with Love
– Brave Wins
– No More Wars
– For The People
– Our Moment
– Amy for America
– Wayne for America
– Seth Moulton for America
– We’re All In This Together
– Our Future is Now
– Not Me. Us.
– Join The Evolution
– Humanity First
– America Has A Choice
https://ballotpedia.org/Presidential_campaign_logos_and_slogans,_2020
17Sorry about the Breitbart link. There were others.
18I’ll be voting for whoever wins the primary. I just want Trump and his minions defeated, not only in the WH, but in the Senate and in the House.
19Sorry, Williamson? In what way does she “keep the others honest”? She’s a crackpot who wants to defeat Trump with “love” and believes positive thoughts can cure disease. All the others seem presidential just by not advocating magic crystals and meditation. I don’t understand why the DNC allowed her into an overcrowded field — like entering your pony in the Kentucky Derby.
20I like Liz Warren, too, but keep in mind that she’s only a year into a six-year term and that we in Massachusetts have, surprisingly, a Republican governor. He’s a reasonable adult, and I like him, but he’s still a Republican and he will appoint Warren’s successor. Who will, almost certainly, also be a Republican. And on top of that, much as I like Warren, I’m afraid she wouldn’t win a general election. We can recover from four years of Trump, but I’m not sure about eight.
21EJ –
Okay; so, months before any primaries, and way over a year before the election, and after a single debate, you want to cut the field from 20 to 2 ??
And the guy you favor is nearly 80 years old. And turned in a performance most charitably described as mediocre.
Well, it’s efficient, anyway. Totally nutzoid and counterproductive, but efficient.
The purpose is to help us select our candidate, sure. But the debates also serve to help form our party platform; to see how different policy ideas play out in public and against opposing solutions; and to raise the national profile of some of our younger, lesser known party members.
Debates help us to form, confirm, or change our opinions on the candidates. For instance, I didn’t know anything about Delaney; now I do, and I don’t like him. I had a bad opinion of Gabbard, but was impressed by her performance. And I didn’t care for Gillibrand, and still don’t.
Debating multiple opponents sharpens the skills of whoever ultimately has to go up against the Orange Nightmare, the most dishonest, dirtiest fighter in modern history. The same two people encountering and battling only each other for nearly a year is a sure way for the public to lose all interest in the party, and our plan for the country. For every misstatement by either, no matter how trivial, to be featured for at least an entire news cycle by the MSM. And for demented Donny to savage and stereotype them to death.
Not to mention that if the people are to make an actual choice, a number of candidates still have to be around for the primaries.
It needs to pare way down, obviously. At least a third of the candidates had no business being there, though the only ones I’d dismiss out of hand are Williamson and Yang, and realistically I’d cut 5 more. But on her program last night, Rachel Maddow went down the list, and showed that every person up on that stage on each night had a moment where they contributed something unique to the debate. Every. single. one.
So yeah, I’m okay with the huge format for another month. Bring it on; no one is forcing us to watch. The criteria tightens and the field narrows in October. And by the end of the year, we should be down to a reasonable field, maybe 8 or so.
Some people call that a waste of time. I call it an embarrassment of riches.
22Biden is toast.
23He and his inside baseball stchick lo#t when Hillary tried it and would lose again.
Plus he is just to polite and respectful of the institutions, no matter how corrupted and gutted they are, to do anything positive.
Just as he sold out on the bush tax cut he will continue to sell the farm for a bowl of porridge just so he could claim to have made a deal.
Biden all the weaknesses of Hillary with out any of her saving graces
Buttermilk Sky@20, she’s like the IQ4.5 in a diaper balloons, best suited to aerial display praying over Donnie’s Nazi rallies or the front lawn of the WH.
Alan@13 asked a great question. “…how the DNC is supposed to restrict the candidate field…” A conundrum for certain. But maybe the DNC could as a minimum avoid the appearance of wrong doing by allowing the first 3 food fights to proceed as planned, then thin the herd with plenty of advance notice as to qualifying criteria for future debates. Maybe 5% in 3 legitimate polls, cash on hand and number of contributors formula. Where’s political operative extraordinaire and all around great guy daChipster to give guidance to the best formula going forward?
24@ Buttermilk Sky 20:
The DNC was powerless to keep Williamson off the stage. They set the criteria months ago — changing them at the last minute just because some folks were stupid enough to give her money and/or back her in polls would smack of rigging the results.
Hell, it would BE rigging the results.
They need to maintain their relevance even if a “candidate” has none.
Aamof, given the recent history of our elections, who’s to say that money or those poll results didn’t come straight from the Kremlin? It’s not up to the DNC to thwart Russia at this juncture — it’s up to us.
25Even better, it’s up to the Justice Department. **snortle! chork!**
As a side light it is reported that schumer is trying to recruit a thuglican to run as a D for Senate in Kansas. Oh he did “switch” last year after helping to trash the state all through the brownback years.
26Oh yeah these are the sort of d’ we need. Still sticking to thuglican economic and social policy’s but given the imprimatuer from the d leader to continue to subvert the d agenda.
This is Biden’s type of senator, one who will help the r’s, sabuatage the d’s and push for reactionary bigotry in all policy matters.
But hey at least He got a deal.
@mega – I deleted the link to Breitbart. We don’t want to give them any more fuel than they already have. Please post an alternative link and I’ll leave it up.
27This country hasn’t seen a debate since the parties took it away from the LWV.
We just watched a dog and pony show. It may be good practice for the candidates, but the public didn’t learn much about any of them.
I can see that raise your hand if you want illegals to have free healthcare as a commercial played a 100 times a day.
28Harris was killer, Warren too. Either of those two could beat Wilted Weenie (trump) at anything with half their brain tied behind their back. Biden was mediocre at best, patronizing, confused. Go home, Biden, and take grumpy old man Sanders with you. Booker was sharp and tough. Buttigieg willing to take responsibility for his actions in direct contrast to weaselly Biden. I’m with the others in liking a Warren/Harris or vice versa ticket.
Beto has the most annoying cadence and tone of voice. He can go home too. Didn’t find Castro compelling. Gabbard was the cutest and made a great point about war, but that was it. Bye Tulsi. DeBlasio might have potential. I want to see him in another debate. Amy Klobuchar is a good senator, my Senator, but doesn’t really have the pizzazz of Warren, Harris, Booker or Buttigieg. She needs to ratchet it up significantly for her next opportunity or go home. Our governor is a Democrat so if Amy would be on the ticket or get an administration position, a Democrat would replace her. I think Amy would be a good president, though not as liberal as I’d like.
Yang, Inslee, Castro, Gillibrand, Williamson, Delaney, Ryan, Hickenlooper,
29Bennet, Swalwell can all go home. They got the opportunity to make their points, push their pet issues, have their 15 minutes of fame. You did your duty. Bye.
For the second time in a period of five months, Sen. Kamala Harris was forced to clarify Friday morning that she does not support eliminating private health insurance just hours after making it seem to many that she did.
https://www.commondreams.org/news/2019/06/28/no-no-i-do-not-kamala-harris-clarifies-she-does-not-support-abolishing-private
30K @21,
Wellll gooolllyyy, for once I agree 100hunertpurcent with K.
Imo, Biden shouldn’t have even entered this race. If we could get a retread I’d rather have Al Gore.
Way back in ’15 I warned y’all that Hillary wasn’t going to make it [against what I figured would happen, which pretty much did, even worse].
Agreeing with most of the rest of y’all too.
But absolutely not with El Jefe’s endorsement of Biden.
He could not beat the RAT45-Putin’sPussy juggernaut. Not his fault, he’s just the wrong General from the last war. We need to be fighting today’s and the future war [which Schumer and Pelosi now appear to be losing too, not good].
I luv and respect the guy, but his limit was as an adequate VP and his time is long past [and I actually remember watching Joe on the old McNeil-Lehrer Newshour and WashWeek, Frontline, back from the 1970’s; he was considered a foreign policy guru and was usually returning from somewhere ‘hot’].
.
The rest?, still prefer Warren, but would/will vote for a ham sandwich or a hamster marked “D”. Anything to bury the Republicks.
Even Castro, who I sort of wished well; until his recent seeming to advocate ‘open borders’. No, totally wrong approach, imo.
A subject, like doing away with private health insurance and certain other snakebite topics, that should be largely avoided by D’s [I’ve supported universal single-payer health care since I watched the Canadians do it ~1968; but convincing the average JoeSixPack is almost impossible, have tried since the ’70’s…].
Would/will still vote for any one of them that wins the primary, against the treasonous MangoМосква Shitgibbon.
It is not going to be up to the eventual Democratic candidate. IT WILL BE UP TO US to destroy our common enemy [yes, it is a war, many of y’all still don’t seem to get that].
31Having speculated, as others, who would best match up with syphilitic donnie in a debate one must question whether there will be any debates>
32Doddering dons team might work to keep him out of a dbate and just do rally’s.
They might even do this contrary to his fevered brain desires.
They could do this by demanding that debates be held at mar e lago and that he gets paid for not just the venue but to even show up. They could then demand complete control of whomever is in attendnce, be it press or other audience. The list goe on on how they could sabutauge the debates.
For all but biden who will agree to anything just so he could claim to have made a deal.
In this way biden echo’s the demented one in the sense that the getting a “deal” is more important then what the deal does.
Just like when he helped the thug’s make the bush tax cuts permanent.
Oh and remember that as senator from Visa he placed the “rights” credit card scams above humans in the bankruptcy bill.
Dang, K @23 now, not K @21 [due to the comment approval process delay on some].
33Sandridge@ 31
34Gee I guess sometimes the twain do meet.
Mahalo
Mahalo Nui Loa a K.
Try this [if you’re not OI]:
http://kkcr.org/index.html
[listening and member off/on since ~’97, wish KKCR were on Siriusxm dang it, a pita to stream it]
35Won’t support Warren as long as she wants to eliminate private health insurance because I don’t want to give up Medicare Advantage. Someone super smart, articulate, responsible, ethical and moderate would be my choice. That’s Buttegieg. But will vote blue no matter who. Wish Dems would argue the issues and positions instead of ad hominem attacks.
36Samantha Bee is Canadian
37Biden, yes, definitely. Sorry Kamala but the man is not a racist. I am old enough to know what the hell he was saying cuz I saw it happen. Ask yourself, dear, would Obama have picked a racist as his VP? NOPE. Thats what most of us think. So you were a part of history as a child. Don’t over play that hand. It could come up to smack you.
Kamila would make a far, far better AG in the DOJ than what we have now, but I could make that comparison with a gold fish and be right on!
Castro – well he blew a few minds around here! Did not expect that! And he has a twin! If he were VP or even Prez, it wouldn’t take any work at all for them to switch jobs for a day or two so the other could rest. Same for young Rep. Kennedy who is not running for the White House this time around!
Bernie, God bless him. As for him being a Socialist, aren’t we all children of Franklin Delano Roosevelt and his Social Security? If there is really anyone out there who hates socialism that much, then give up your Social Security! Yeah, I just bet you will!
Warren – she should be the Majority Leader in the Senate as in the first woman to be such. She is an excellent wagon train leader and cracks exactly the right kind of whip.
Klobuchar – greatly admired her Total Iron-ness during the Kavanaugh hearings. She would make one really good, nasty bad ass member of the Supreme Court.
Have a very real reservation about governors who want to to be Prez. Have noticed over the years that guys seem to like to do stuff such as call out the local militia or guard or whatever you call them.
38@Brad – Rupert Murdoch is Australian and controls much of US and UK media. What’s your point?
39I’ve heard so many folks say they would vote for a turnip(or other noun) instead of Trump. In light of that I would like a Democratic candidate who is really good. I just feel that Biden and Bernie are yesterday’s news and I’m ready for fresh ideas. I’m not sure yet who I think it will be but, even if it is a turnip, I’ll vote for him or her.
40Brad, all the better! She has the perspective denied the rest of Americans as the are too close to the forest to often see the trees.
41Deviance alert: I’m for Inslee, the only one who correctly called the biggest danger: climate change.
Too much single issue purity, especially on the outrage du jour, immigration. LGBTQPOC.
The vast masses are deeply tired and annoyed at the endless grabs for popular attention. The masses are beginning to recognize clickbait.
National health CARE (not access to crappy insurance).
Rein in the executive branch (AUMF, for starters.) Our military adventure will have very few allies, if any. The Brute USA will fight alone and lose another Vietnam.
If Donnie ain’t bad enough for a Democrat sweep, we’re Germany pre-WWII. My hunch is Dems will lose. Democracy needs sane voters.
42Brad
43Samantha Bee became a US citizen in 2014, while retaining her Canadian citizenship.
I have to agree with El Jefe. I think Biden has the best shot at taking Trump down.
44Depressingly, no Dem has a chance at the Presidency in the foreseeable future because the Supreme Court just handed the keys to the kingdom to the Rethugs by allowing gerrymandering to continue unabated and without supervision by the courts. All is lost.
45EJ prefers the old white guy (surprise!) and takes a spiteful and false shot at another blonde female Senator from New York (sprite, surprise!). Other than these apparently irremediable habits, he is right that the bottom half of the field should go back to their day jobs or run for Senate.
Sad to see so much misinformation in the comments. Castro is not for open borders, as he has clearly stated. He is for changing the nature of the crime of entering illegally from criminal to civil. I.E. he wants to close the concentration camps.
I’m going to vote as Rachel advises: with my heart in the primary and my head for the D, even if it’s the one I really dislike, in the general.
@Maryelle, yep that was bad news. But giving up is what they want you to do. You going to oblige them? I’m not.
46In one way, I agree with El Jefe (a rarity, I assure you) that debates this early are stupid. However, with a field this big it’s useful to start the culling process early and get down to the few candidates who stand a serious chance of being elected. It’s also useful to allow fringe candidates and the really odd ones enough rope to hang themselves quickly.
47maryelle @45, Along with many others, you’re a bit confused on how gerrymandering works. Gerrymandering itself will have no effect on statewide or national ‘majority vote’ elections like the Presidential election [except if low drive, spiteful, and/or apathetic voters stay home, btw, a large D cohort; the Thugs will always turn out 100%+, even if dying].
Gerrymandering has its’ greatest/only effect on US Representative and state and local offices selected by ‘districts’.
This does have a tremendous effect, but your
“no Dem has a chance at the Presidency in the foreseeable future because the Supreme Court just handed the keys to the kingdom to the Rethugs by allowing gerrymandering to continue” has little to nothing to do with gerrymandered districts at any level.
The Presidential election is won on a whole state vote count majority, winner takes all, Electoral College allocation [in most states, 1 or 2 are slightly different iirc].
Gerrymandered district vote counts are still counted on an entirely statewide level for the statewide and Prez elections, which means that even if the districts are tilted and packed for the Republicks, a state can still go to a Dem Prez or Governor, etc.
Today’s post-2018 election Wisconsin is a good example: Republickers still have a gerrymandered lock on the statehouse and many local offices, but WI now has a Dem Guv, Senator, etc.
Gerrymandering is still a bad thing, but it just doesn’t [directly] apply to the Prez election.
48Msb, The point is: these Democrats like Castro, et al., are opening up perceived, very subjective cans of worms that are dead certain losers at the national level.
Things that even sound like ‘open borders’ or ‘decriminalizing’ are now, and will be, absolute DOA poison in the 2020 election [or any other].
I know what he means [I’m not far from San Antonio, receive 4-5 dang emails a day from Julian], but he and his campaign are bloody idiots to drop this bucket of worms on the national stage; it’s going to kill ANY Dem running for anything!
The MangoМосква and the raving Rethugs are already ecstatic and cranking up their propaganda Wurlitzers to the max.
The misunderstood ‘Medicare for All’ area is another political loser att [I’ve tried to advocate it to co-workers since the Canadians went ‘socialist’, it’s impossible to explain it to low-info brainwashed Joe&Jo Sixpacks].
And I write this as someone who now lives not too far from La Frontera, how many of y’all are within 1000 miles of it? I could drive down there well before suppertime, and had spent most of my life living within 10 miles of it.
49One of the issues with Biden is that he is not just old but that his mind is trapped in a past time when it was OK to yuck it up with racists.
First he offends, african americans by comparing racist calling him son to them being called boy, today he commits the same sin in Seattle over his comments about LGBTQ people. The “Liberalism” of the 60’s just doesn’t cut it anymore but that is where he is stuck.
At one time even being allowed on the bus was considered a step forward until Rosa Parks led the way out of the back of the bus. So it is for so many things.
Think of even how phrases and casual references of my distant youth have been deleted from civil conversation when the roots and references at the roots of those phrases are understood.
From casual associations of specific groups when bargaining or accusation of cheating phrases that were part of mainstream conversation back then are, rightfully, unacceptable now.
Just as the older generation accepted more passive racism then is acceptable today, in part because it was a step up from the nightriders terrorizing the community, today that passive racism is called out as racism, social standards move on.
The nomlecture of how people wish to be addressed has changed.
Some accuse this of being part of a “PC” movement when in reality they have just redefined common courtesy as being “PC” when that courtesy is required for other groups.
In Bidens case he is still stick in the past where he was instrumental in helping move society forward, but one is not allowed to rest upon their past laurels nor hold onto outdated standards that have not moved on with society.
One of the standards that has changed is that racist’s such as thurmond, helms, king, et.al. are properly shunned in civil society
This is part of why he doesn’t accept, or understand, Harris’s comments on his record, this is why he will lose if nominaited.
ps I will vote for anyone nominaited by the d’s ( unless they go bats*** and nominaite Ivanka) so this is not a threat but rather a warning.
50